Yeah, obviously. But reproduce too much and you end up dying off.

[below debate moved from here: http://forums.krazyletter.com/http://forums.krazyletter.com/index.php?showtopic=25]

Which is my next argument against modern medicine. lol.

Against modern medicine? Modern medicine saves lives!

And allows crappy genetics to be passed on, disrupting the natural order of evolution. Plus, as Mynick stated, if we reproduce too much, we seal our own fate, and modern medicine allows us to kill ourselves in such a way.

That is indeed what the body is made for. But as humans are sentient beings, they must find other purposes in life to fulfill their dreams, that is what makes us different from other living beings.

But that doesnt change the purpose or our existance. We may find things to do in our spare time (which is most of the time), but nothing that really betters our reproduction or evolution. The human body was never meant to live as long as it does now, and because of it new diseases have been able to evolve. The growth of the population due to modern technology already shows drastic side effects on our natural surroundings, and can they can only worsen should the population continue to grow at what is pretty much an exponential rate.

So, are you against research for medicine? The Japanese have the longest average lifetime of any nation. But this is not only because of medicine, or even herbs. The Japanese eat a healthy diet of rice, fish, seaweed, cucumbers, et cetera.

The way I see it, if you arent fit to live and reproduce, you shouldnt. This goes especially for genetic disease research.
They, along with the rest of the human race, would never make it past forty without modern medicines.

There may be some truth in what you say, but I think that is kind of mean. I mean, if you are born with disabilities, that shouldn't make you deserve to die. You do not get to choose to be born or to choose how you are born.

And neither do the baby impala who get mowed down by a lioness because they were too slow. Thats survival of the fittest for ya, and if everyone survives, no progress is made.

But what if a person is impotent and has cancer but has a very high IQ and work-ethic?

What the [bleeped!] does it matter their IQ? If they die then that means they werent fit. Period. And cancer is a product of humans in itself, so bad example.

But that's exactly what I'm saying, if the person is saved, then the person can do something wonderful.

And I doubt it, cancer has been around for several decades.

Cancer has been around ever since there were animals. Modern industry just made it worse.

Cancer has been around since humans have been putting inorganic substances into their bodys, conciously or non. Thats what causes cancer, and its humankinds own fault. And how can someone do something good if they cant do anything for themselves??? Thats exactly what I'M saying, and what I said is totally different from what you said.

But that's exactly what I'm saying, if we research medicine, the person will be able to do something good for more people.

So this person can do something "good" and pass on their defective genes to plague the race for years to come. Pure frigging genious.

You sound like Hugo Drax from the 1979 movie Moonraker. He thought that people needed to have perfect genes to become a perfect race. So he decided to get "perfect" people and kill everyone else on Earth, then return to the planet and start a new race. And then he got killed by British secret agent James Bond with the nerve reflex-activated wrist-gun with a cyanide-tipped dart.

Hitler also thought that people needed to have perfect genes and those who did not can just die.

Haha, wasn't Hugo Drax betrayed by one of his high-ranking people, Jaws (or whatever his name was)?

They dont have to have "perfect" genes. They need to have genes that dont have serious errors in them. If youre going to die from a genetic disease, why prolong it and have children, just to let your children take the chance of inheriting that gene? It doesnt make any sense.

I find truth in what you say about reproducing, but I think that the person whould still have the right to live.

Theres no such thing as the right to live. Its a privelige, and if you cant stick it out, you lose that privelige.

Maybe so, but just because a person is born with a disability doesn't mean that he/she automatically loses the "privilege" to live. So you basically just disproved yourself.

Nope, person born with the disability still has the privelige to live as long as they can just plain live, you moron. Dont interpret what I say, take it exactly how I say it, you douche.

But you were saying that if a person had defective genes that they should die.

And I quote (myself) "They dont have to have "perfect" genes. They need to have genes that dont have serious errors in them. If youre going to die from a genetic disease, why prolong it and have children"
Read it again, moron.

You said, "Why prolong it", and that means that you think that they should just die.

Yes, IF THEY ARE GOING TO DIE ANYWAYS. If they ARENT, then they should live. You wouldnt mis-interpret what I say if you didnt take it as I said it.

But now, we are discussing people who do indeed rely on the results of medical research to survive. There is something called "in context".

Being slightly off-topic...

@HerLoss: what's a douuce?

@myscrnnm: right. but HerLoss is saying that don't waste medical research on people who aren't fit to live anyway.

I know, but I think that is wrong. Cuz people aren't born deserving to live or die. It is their actions that determine whether they should live or die.

That's true. But how do you know if you are making a big mistake by allowing that person to live?

You don't, and that is why people get chances.

You give them the chance by allowing them to live on their own with out medical inovations. People should live as if there was no medical intervention, and if they cant live without it, then they shouldnt live to disrupt evolution.

Edit: @KC: A douche is a feminine hygene product, used to clean out the vagina. Basically its a hollow dildo thats open on one end, and has a bunch of holes in the other. You connect a douche bag, basically a plasitc bag fillied with salene solution, to the open end of the douche, insert, and squeeze the bag.

If people lived as if there was no medical intervention, then all this expensive medical research will have gone to waste.

No [bleeped!] sherlock. My argument is anti-medicine.

I know, that's why I'm arguing against you, cuz I think medicine is good.

But you just said what I have been trying to tell you the whole time, You finally got the point, and now your going to turn your stroke of genious into idiocy.

I am not agreeing with what you've been telling me, I was merely saying that is what you are trying to tell me. But like I've said from the beginning, I don't agree with it.

Thats obviously what I am trying to tell you, and you apparently didnt understand untill now. I dont expect you to agree with it, but I do expect you to stop mirroring what I say, and then just saying you dont agree with it.

Medicine is cool and all, but I try to avoid it as much as I can >.<

Overall though, I'm pro... so... yeah.

Well, I think this discussion has been vague. But from what I hear, HerLoss is against these medical aides, not just medicine itself. But I think that this medical research is good.

From what you hear? Why dont you just friggin quote me. I have said time and time again that I am against medical research where it interferes with evolution, where it interferes with the natural order.

Ah, so you are indeed supportive of evolution, me too.

I never said I wasnt, moron.

I didn't say you said you weren't.

medicine is both good and bad. It allows people to live, but as HerLoss says, it just allows the defective gene to be passed on to the next generation.

if we all ate really healthily, then we would have much less need for medicine.

not to mention if we used less energy from coal-burning power plants. and junk from chemical factories. and big industry in general.

Yes, which is why we need to learn from exmaple, the Japanese!